Vertices - How do I make their alignment "smooth"?

Robert Gödicke

Hello everyone!

I just started my very first car project in 3DS Max, and there's something I am totally not happy with.
I was looking for tutorials and found this one.

The technique shown in the video is simple, but works. Creating an object starts with a simple object, afterwards you're selecting edges and "pull" them while holding the Shift Key to create new faces.

Like I said, it works, but somehow I got the impression that the car models of the professional rFactor modders, like those of ( _your_name_here_ ), probably use another technique to align their vertices in a way that they're forming perfect bézier curves like this:

bezier.jpg


I used the technique from the video and my very first few steps look like this:



You can clearly see that edges which belong together do not form such pretty curves like I've seen in other mods.



Now here's my question: Could someone please share their knowledge with me/us?
I know that you'll learn the most by try 'n' error, but a little help might come in handy. ;)

Regards, Rob
 
That's called smoothing. Go to face mode and select all, then in the rollout go down to polygon smoothing groups and turn on smoothing group 1.

Here is a really good tutorial, http://www.3dtotal.com/team/Tutorials/fiat500/fiat500_m01.php

Just a note, you don't need that many polys at the stage your at, best to keep the poly count as low as possible until you have the body done. Once you turn smoothing on you will notice that you don't need so many.

[ED] Aim for about 2500 polys for the shell of the car (the whole car shell right and left, 1250 for half). Turn on statistics so you can keep an eye on it.
 
Hey mianiak!
Thanks for the quick reply, but that's not what I'm looking for.

I know about smoothing groups, I didn't activate them in my screenshot to make my problem more visible.
This is how it'll look with smoothing groups:



What I meant is the actual wireframe, so to say. I positioned all of those vertices by hand, while it seems like others maybe used some kind of method to make the vertex positioning more "mathematically correct". Dunno how to describe my problem exactly...
 
Robert Gödicke said:
What I meant is the actual wireframe, so to say. I positioned all of those vertices by hand, while it seems like others maybe used some kind of method to make the vertex positioning more "mathematically correct". Dunno how to describe my problem exactly...
Click to expand...

What you are looking for is modelling with splines and making shapes with them in 3D, one way for example spline cage modelling, there are different ways.

Remind me sometime, got to run, but got some links somewhere but there are plenty tuts out there, not for cars so much but the techiques follow. As you say you got to be very disciplined and have good eye to keep things smooth with this old style apporach, that said the 3ds max 2010 poly graphite tools make things better. Both techniques have pros and cons IMO, I've used both interchangebly.

To do with splines and so on you need to do it, practice it, it is a bit harder to foresee the end result that way, but ultimately can give better results, smoother meshes thay follow mathematical rules, but watch the polycount, very easy to overdo it that way.

There is also nurbs, but remember that ultimately you got to end up with a mesh, reasonable structure keeping polycount in check. I see often some very good meshes around in many tutorials, but often they are not much use for games with the extreme polycounts, that is if you want a sizeable grid of cars running to acceptable limits.

Personally if that is a first effort think you did a great job with the old style edge loop. It would look decent and smooth enough ingame :)

edit: There is one other method I use also, call it perhaps may be the afborro method ^^ Don't know, never seen anyone suggest it, but that is to use splines as guides only, and use the old style modelling on top to place/snap you verts using the spline as a guide. Your wheel arch there could be a very good example, begin by drawing some spline on the blueprint using the handles to get a nice curve etc, I think you see where I am going hope ....

Yes you can break the rules the exact splines curves use, but it can give good results, and above all, it is a simple approach, and I love simple things :)
 
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Hey afborro!

This sounds more like the stuff I'm looking for...
So, can I snap the Vertices to a spline curve? Sorry I can't test it right now, but I guess it works by activating "Curve Edge" under "Grid and Snap Settings -> Snaps -> NURBS"?

That would help a lot. A "guideline" I can snap my Vertices to is pretty much exactly what I was hoping to get. :)
Thank you!

By the way I remade this little part of the fender with quite less polys, the end result with Smoothing Groups looks pretty much the same:

 
Ahh ok, no worries. Well my answer to your Q would be,,,
(I do it a bit different to how afborro explains. So I'll just share my technique to give you an idea of the bigger picture. In the end you do what ever feels comfortable.)

I make the shell in very low polys, then later after the shell is made, use either meshsmooth or connect to add in extra polys and build out the shape. In the beginning I used to always get stuck putting too much detail into the front guard, then finding later on that it just got in the way, plus it never looked smooth :D. So the low poly start approach seemed to be the most efficient way, it keeps things inline and when you do start adding extra polys, everything is already inline and it comes out smooth.

I would go with about half of the polys that you have in your latest pic. ie, Once you have done the wheel arch, just extrude up once to the top of the guard, then out once from the top of the guard to the side of the hood, then model the side, front and back.
Then once the side and rear guard is made, I'd ring select the edges on the upper part from front to back and use connect to add in that extra edge, then in vertex mode I'd pull them out and build in the shape of the side.

Here is a short video showing how I would go about making a car shell.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2L-FBnZP1A
That was done in Blender, I use 3dmax now but there is not really much difference, just different names for everything.

Are you working in quads or tri's? in that pic its triangles, best to work with quads, makes it easier to divide things up.
 
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