clockit
Something I discovered today, rFactor works with negative rolling resistance value in the TBC and the results are very similar to raising the track resistance in the TDF.
RollingHeat
They can't change it in version rF2 now, then all the tracks that have been made from the beginning won't work. They obviously know the scenario. It would be interesting to see how it turns out. If they admit to this huge mistake or try to slip it by. The funny thing is all the mods that are out claiming they have real world data, not admitting manipulating other data to get it to work. ISI has a reason why they are not using this setting, missing parameters? engine doesn't work correctly with it? Who knows...... and we certainly won't find out. Very disturbing!!!
LesiU
Not neccesary! You have to do some sort of convertion from rF 1 to rF 2 none the less. Changing surface resistance is a matter of changing few parameters in tdf from 0 to different value.
As for cars, things will be more time consuming, especially for mods that were made entirely based on feeling and lap times. They will have to match the mod again, probably from scratch (depending on how many parameters are off).
There is still one things that bothers me a bit and not allowing to just say "I'm with additional reistance". It is lack of drivetrain inertia in rF 1. You have clutch inertia and then wheel inertia. Yeah, you can compensate drivetrain inertia under wheel parameter but I'm not sure if that will work like expected.
And by the way. Recently my friend measured friction torque in his friend's Honda CRX gearbox. Clutch friction was almost non existant (you can easilly rotate it with your fingers without almost no effort). Friction torque in gearbox was changing with different gears engaged and was between 1.5 and 3.0 Nm So with friction torque on spindle of about 0.75 (measured from 997 Cup) you can assume about 2.5Nm per driven wheel.
Of course gearbox from a road going car is not the same like in GT racing car... but by how much? It still will be something about 3-4Nm per driven wheel. Now compare that with typical "FrictonTroque" values found in most mods ;-)
Without surface resistance, your vehicle will be just too fast.
I'm wondering, why ISI didn't say a word yet about that topic?
As for cars, things will be more time consuming, especially for mods that were made entirely based on feeling and lap times. They will have to match the mod again, probably from scratch (depending on how many parameters are off).
There is still one things that bothers me a bit and not allowing to just say "I'm with additional reistance". It is lack of drivetrain inertia in rF 1. You have clutch inertia and then wheel inertia. Yeah, you can compensate drivetrain inertia under wheel parameter but I'm not sure if that will work like expected.
And by the way. Recently my friend measured friction torque in his friend's Honda CRX gearbox. Clutch friction was almost non existant (you can easilly rotate it with your fingers without almost no effort). Friction torque in gearbox was changing with different gears engaged and was between 1.5 and 3.0 Nm So with friction torque on spindle of about 0.75 (measured from 997 Cup) you can assume about 2.5Nm per driven wheel.
Of course gearbox from a road going car is not the same like in GT racing car... but by how much? It still will be something about 3-4Nm per driven wheel. Now compare that with typical "FrictonTroque" values found in most mods ;-)
Without surface resistance, your vehicle will be just too fast.
I'm wondering, why ISI didn't say a word yet about that topic?
Jim Pejsa
I understand the ClutchFriction simulates both the clutch and tranny friction. Friction in the differential can be modeled in the appropriate wheel's FrictionTorque. I would think you could model drivetrain inertia by including it in the ClutchInertia parameter.
RollingHeat
Yes of course it is that simple, depending if you want the track surface the exact same all the way around the track in all grooves. thats not the way it is in reality.
But...... just changing that value the same everywhere, the car would be too slow. they would have to change the car physics to get it to the cars actual speed. The track surface resistance is 0 therefore the car is not setup as real as it should because they had to compensate and change values on the car to match real car speed.
This needs to be utilized in RF2 along with varying track surface resistance with time , temp etc.... it all is combined to make up the physics of the sim. Without this then it doesn't really matter. It is just another update with nice fancy graphics and the physics not as real or as good as it can be. then we are back to square one trying to manipulate RF to get what we want.
Big circle of madness....
ISI, What are your thoughts on this????
LesiU
Madness? This is Sp... rFactor ;-)
ClutchFriction is not clutch friction. It exists only when you are on gear. When being on neutral, it has no influence. Because of that, you can't model drivetrain friction (which of course includes gearbox, but not only).
ClutchFriction is not clutch friction. It exists only when you are on gear. When being on neutral, it has no influence. Because of that, you can't model drivetrain friction (which of course includes gearbox, but not only).
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rogdini
You meant ClutchInertia? I don't really think drivetrain inertia is significant when in neutral, not only because we don't spent many time in neutral when driving but because when we do so, acceleration rates are low. We can set transmission inertia through engine, clutch and driven wheels which I think it's OK, we can't set different inertias for each gear (lower gears usually have slightly higher inertia) but still i don't think it's a big matter of concern.
Clutch friction is a completely different thing and can be used to simulate torque loss through transmission.
Clutch friction is a completely different thing and can be used to simulate torque loss through transmission.
LesiU
I've made correction. Of course it was about friction, like in the first part of the sentence. Inertia is a different thing and as with friction, you can't simulate that for drivetrain directly.
JorgeANeto
Guys, this "Resistance" parameter means how much the car "sinks" on the material. For instance, in gravel you should use higher values, or even highest in sand traps if you want the car stucks. Just check out the resistance values for these sort of materials into original TDFs.
In higher resistances values, you need less RPM and more torque. That explains how you cannot to throttle too much to get out of a sand trap and need to use clutch to raise RPMs.
No use for tarmac surfaces.
In higher resistances values, you need less RPM and more torque. That explains how you cannot to throttle too much to get out of a sand trap and need to use clutch to raise RPMs.
No use for tarmac surfaces.
LesiU
It is as it says - how resistive the material is against an object, when you want to move through it (or on it, whatever).
You can't move out of sand because you are digged into it and sand is loose, so you have no grip. With resistance parameter, you emulate that behaviour (because rF can't simulate loose surfaces).
If you have reasonable explanation (because it looks, ISI don't have one) why properly done mods, with proper values for engine, aero and mechanical drag and inertia, are way too fast with surface resistance set to 0 then I maybe agree with you (but then, what about what Mirrza have measured at Brno racetrack? ). Until that, sorry
You can't move out of sand because you are digged into it and sand is loose, so you have no grip. With resistance parameter, you emulate that behaviour (because rF can't simulate loose surfaces).
If you have reasonable explanation (because it looks, ISI don't have one) why properly done mods, with proper values for engine, aero and mechanical drag and inertia, are way too fast with surface resistance set to 0 then I maybe agree with you (but then, what about what Mirrza have measured at Brno racetrack? ). Until that, sorry
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JorgeANeto
Hi LesliU, I'm not a car modder, but I'm supposing here those “properly done mods" which you referred use they own *.TBC tire compound files. This file has some variables that are multiplied by surfaces properties present in *.TDF file of the track.
It’s important to mention that tire model for driver car is not the same those AI cars, which have a simplified grip model to improve the game performance (maybe running under newers I7 cores it wont be necessary)
Softness=0.55 // Softness is now just for AI strategic use
AIGripMult=1.040 // Grip multiplier for AI vehicles (due to tire model simplification)
AIPeakSlip=0.092 // Simple peak slip angle for AI vehicles
AIWear=0.701e-7 // AI wear rate constant
I supose AI cars are way faster in 0 resistance surfaces because the game engine bypass zero values and uses integral AI grip. Any positive values will affect the AI car’s grip, reducing top speeds due the friction.
However I agree that some “official” support would be very welcome. But I'm guessing that any track should have track resistance > 0 for all tarmac surfaces. It won't affect the human performance but the AI cars instead. This variable appears to have a impact on driving exponentially, values down than 500 are insignificant to a human lap time but neither to AI lap time.
It’s important to mention that tire model for driver car is not the same those AI cars, which have a simplified grip model to improve the game performance (maybe running under newers I7 cores it wont be necessary)
Softness=0.55 // Softness is now just for AI strategic use
AIGripMult=1.040 // Grip multiplier for AI vehicles (due to tire model simplification)
AIPeakSlip=0.092 // Simple peak slip angle for AI vehicles
AIWear=0.701e-7 // AI wear rate constant
I supose AI cars are way faster in 0 resistance surfaces because the game engine bypass zero values and uses integral AI grip. Any positive values will affect the AI car’s grip, reducing top speeds due the friction.
However I agree that some “official” support would be very welcome. But I'm guessing that any track should have track resistance > 0 for all tarmac surfaces. It won't affect the human performance but the AI cars instead. This variable appears to have a impact on driving exponentially, values down than 500 are insignificant to a human lap time but neither to AI lap time.
It is as it says - how resistive the material is against an object, when you want to move through it (or on it, whatever).
You can't move out of sand because you are digged into it and sand is loose, so you have no grip. With resistance parameter, you emulate that behaviour (because rF can't simulate loose surfaces).
If you have reasonable explanation (because it looks, ISI don't have one) why properly done mods, with proper values for engine, aero and mechanical drag and inertia, are way too fast with surface resistance set to 0 then I maybe agree with you (but then, what about what Mirrza have measured at Brno racetrack? ). Until that, sorry
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LesiU
But who cares about AI performance? With one parameter, I can make AI beeing much slower or faster, but it has nothing to do with what we are talking about
JorgeANeto
But who cares about AI performance? With one parameter, I can make AI beeing much slower or faster, but it has nothing to do with what we are talking about
LOL... I was thinking that this discussion have some substantive goal (online racing or offline racing) but I'm seeing it's just foolish talk. Online, the parameters will be the same for everyone and offline you can achieve a competitive race, so what is the point?
I don't care if you have to play around "fake" variables to set the cars close to the reality, nor if they reach 0-100 mph in 6.78236 or 6.56446 versus 6.43636 of real life (LOL)... all of the variables here presented and still the "field tests" are completely questionable. Where come from those "tire rolling" values? And, what's the matter by calibrate by hand the track resistance to achieve real lap times?
All of this make no sense, Rfactor is not a NASA physical simulator, it's a model made of partial models that provides a convince driving, that's all.
No offenses.
LesiU
None taken
But it looks like you don't care if you play with simulator or arcade game. For me and a few more people here, rFactor is a simulator. Doesn't matter if it's as complicated as NASA stuff or not. It is a simulator. It simulates real world phenomena. It's based on real world parameters (mostly) so such should be provided. The rest should be tweaked to get desirable effect. So, if I provide proper tyre rolling resistance, proper aero and mechanical drag, proper engine curves, proper inertia...and it is not as should be, then something is still not right. And it looks like, it was about track resistance set to "0". What a coincidence, that setting that to measured ~2500 brought everything back on spot.
So, on one hand, I have my own knowleadge already and see that this modification resolves my problem (and I have strong evidence to think so). On the other hand, you don't care how some things are achieved - you just want a specific final effect. So, why do you care how car modders are achieving that anyway?
But it looks like you don't care if you play with simulator or arcade game. For me and a few more people here, rFactor is a simulator. Doesn't matter if it's as complicated as NASA stuff or not. It is a simulator. It simulates real world phenomena. It's based on real world parameters (mostly) so such should be provided. The rest should be tweaked to get desirable effect. So, if I provide proper tyre rolling resistance, proper aero and mechanical drag, proper engine curves, proper inertia...and it is not as should be, then something is still not right. And it looks like, it was about track resistance set to "0". What a coincidence, that setting that to measured ~2500 brought everything back on spot.
So, on one hand, I have my own knowleadge already and see that this modification resolves my problem (and I have strong evidence to think so). On the other hand, you don't care how some things are achieved - you just want a specific final effect. So, why do you care how car modders are achieving that anyway?
liquido
Sorry if I´m doing something wrong reopening that thread, but I´m noob and I think that is very important.
I was doing a lot of test in my proyect with "resistance" values at 2500 on every tarmac surface, and I have my own contradictions.
the feeling is better now with those values or that's my feeling, but notice shortcomings top speeds, I can leave the car in neutral standing on a slope with a good inclination and the transition between the road and the bumpy ripples false is different .
You also talk about FFB, there is any way to reduce the effect of FFB simulating engine vibration in the steering wheel of the car?
I have a feeling that the engine distorts the effects of weight of the car and even after three years trying different things now I have a very intuitive and direct experience, I'm missing By taking information about the car's weight ... specially at low speed.
RealFeel plugin I use the most current version.
I was doing a lot of test in my proyect with "resistance" values at 2500 on every tarmac surface, and I have my own contradictions.
the feeling is better now with those values or that's my feeling, but notice shortcomings top speeds, I can leave the car in neutral standing on a slope with a good inclination and the transition between the road and the bumpy ripples false is different .
You also talk about FFB, there is any way to reduce the effect of FFB simulating engine vibration in the steering wheel of the car?
I have a feeling that the engine distorts the effects of weight of the car and even after three years trying different things now I have a very intuitive and direct experience, I'm missing By taking information about the car's weight ... specially at low speed.
RealFeel plugin I use the most current version.
MaXyM
Engine vibration my be disabled in PLR file. But I'm quite sure anyone has it disabled
Resistance changes of course affects car performance. But it is a reason why we increase resistance. Without it, cars go too fast, while we are sure that other parts of physics are correct.
Resistance changes of course affects car performance. But it is a reason why we increase resistance. Without it, cars go too fast, while we are sure that other parts of physics are correct.
liquido
But if I put 2500 on tarmac my car will go out of track if I touch one ripple with fake bumps... easy solution is to avoid that fake effect, and it is in my plans... I need more time to remake severals things on Blender and real 3d model of ripples are included.... but maybe the real model will be worse.
one thing that I don't like is the fact that the car is stopped in neutral in the middle of a slope with fairly inclination... that is really uncomfortable, Rfactor course not made to go with the car standing in the middle of the steep slopes of the circuits, but is an indication that something is not right.
thanks for the info and for reply... I need to know more things about materials before let it as done, but i´m afraid there is not much info.
one thing that I don't like is the fact that the car is stopped in neutral in the middle of a slope with fairly inclination... that is really uncomfortable, Rfactor course not made to go with the car standing in the middle of the steep slopes of the circuits, but is an indication that something is not right.
thanks for the info and for reply... I need to know more things about materials before let it as done, but i´m afraid there is not much info.
MaXyM
We increased this value also for rumble stripes. however to some lower value than tarmac (I think 1800 for curbs, while 2500-2700 for tarmac depending on type/age). This is another proof why 0 value is wrong: it cannot be the same for curbs and tarmac. Curbs has lower friction for sure. but if tarmac is set to 0, what value should be set for curbs?
As long as surface resistance may be partially replaced by special values in tyres it probably means that you have tyre physics not prepared to work with modified tarmac. Overall friction is too high, that's why cars are not moving while standing on slopes. At first we did physics of cars, then figured out that tarmac resistance must be modified to match tyres.
There is no official info.
Moreover rF2 has also Resistance set to 0, but as I heard from my collogue which works on physics, new tyre model doesn't make use of this value.
liquido
Thanks for the info, I need to do a lot of test.
My intention is to replace te actual fake ripples by real 3d models, so it means more tests...
would be helpful if you show me where I have to look into the physical of the tires to counteract this effect that makes the car is left standing in the middle of a slope.
either way I SimRacingPL registered on the forum, we will be more on this forum and SimRacingPL forum, I see I have much to learn from you.
My intention is to replace te actual fake ripples by real 3d models, so it means more tests...
would be helpful if you show me where I have to look into the physical of the tires to counteract this effect that makes the car is left standing in the middle of a slope.
either way I SimRacingPL registered on the forum, we will be more on this forum and SimRacingPL forum, I see I have much to learn from you.
GFraser1965
Another parameter that seems wrong in the tdf file is CollFrict
Why would the collisionfriction be higher on grass than on pavement.
The standard tdf file lists it as follows:
road >> CollFrict=0.4
gras >> CollFrict=0.8
This seems very wrong.
Why would the collisionfriction be higher on grass than on pavement.
The standard tdf file lists it as follows:
road >> CollFrict=0.4
gras >> CollFrict=0.8
This seems very wrong.
Johannes Rojola
As how I see it, grass does have higher collision friction. If car rolls over, it can easily slide long distances on tarmac because tarmac is flat and hard surface. But if car hits grass, it digs in it and hits hard.
Check this video. Car number #5 slides long way on the tarmac, but when it hits the grass over it goes.
Pandamasque
In rFactor he'd stay on the roof for many more laps and finish the race like that I'm not sure what exactly is the source of the problem but I often get bored waiting till the car stops 'skating' on its roof (it won't get 'turned over' until it stops).
I'm not sure what exactly is the source of the problem but I often get bored waiting till the car stops 'skating' on its roof (it won't get 'turned over' until it stops).Johannes Rojola
In rFactor he'd stay on the roof for many more laps and finish the race like that
That is definitely a problem in rF. The grass is very flat because it lacks "soil physics". Car doesn't dig in the grass, it just slides. You can increase the collision friction for grass, but it can quickly result in very harsh and buggy collisions.
GFraser1965
@Johannes Rojola
If you wanted to simulate how a car digs into grass you would use the sink= parameter in the tdf file rather than the friction parameter.
No, I think they have this wrong.
Grass is slippery and has less friction against rubber than asphalt.
and grass should not be smooth if the track modder has correctly used the tdf bump parameters:
BumpAmp=
BumpWavelen=
or has added bumps to his grass mesh.
If you wanted to simulate how a car digs into grass you would use the sink= parameter in the tdf file rather than the friction parameter.
No, I think they have this wrong.
Grass is slippery and has less friction against rubber than asphalt.
and grass should not be smooth if the track modder has correctly used the tdf bump parameters:
BumpAmp=
BumpWavelen=
or has added bumps to his grass mesh.
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Johannes Rojola
I believe sink doesn't affect on car body. But still, there is very little sinking going on with grass. I also think that TDF bump settings don't either affect on car body.
ONLY way of improving this that comes to my mind is just to increase coll friction and use quite a dense and bumpy mesh for grass / other soil areas. But that is not very good thing performance wise...
GFraser1965
@Johannes Rojola
Our main concern in a driving sim is how our tires react when in contact with either asphalt/grass/gravel/sand etc....
Whether the body of the car (or roof) sinks into a surface is of a much lesser concern.
Since the tires do sink into grass when the sink= parameter is used that is the key, and should be used accordingly.
And tires are definitely effected by tdf bumps (when using BumpAmp= & BumpWavelen=), which again is our main concern.
Why you are more concerned with how body parts slide on a surface, than how tires interact is really puzzling.
Again since this is a driving sim our main concern is how the tires react when using the resistance parameter
and the collision friction parameter and in both cases it makes sense that these parameters should be higher for asphalt than grass.
Here's an easy test you can do.
Lockup your brakes on asphalt, and lockup your brakes on grass.
On asphalt the friction causes the tires to melt onto the pavement leaving a skidmark, and on grass you simply slide.
The friction is defineatly higher on asphalt.
Done.
Our main concern in a driving sim is how our tires react when in contact with either asphalt/grass/gravel/sand etc....
Whether the body of the car (or roof) sinks into a surface is of a much lesser concern.
Since the tires do sink into grass when the sink= parameter is used that is the key, and should be used accordingly.
And tires are definitely effected by tdf bumps (when using BumpAmp= & BumpWavelen=), which again is our main concern.
Why you are more concerned with how body parts slide on a surface, than how tires interact is really puzzling.
Again since this is a driving sim our main concern is how the tires react when using the resistance parameter
and the collision friction parameter and in both cases it makes sense that these parameters should be higher for asphalt than grass.
Here's an easy test you can do.
Lockup your brakes on asphalt, and lockup your brakes on grass.
On asphalt the friction causes the tires to melt onto the pavement leaving a skidmark, and on grass you simply slide.
The friction is defineatly higher on asphalt.
Done.
Johannes Rojola
Because you questioned why CollFriction is set how it is. CollFriction has nothing to do with tires, it defines how other body parts deal with terrain collisions. That usually happens when you crash your car in the ditch or do rollover crash like in the video I posted.
jtbo
On grass tires do dig in to grass, sometimes ground can be so wet, that you stop really fast even it is really slippery as tires sink so much that they must push much ground at front of them. Also there are softer and less soft ground under the grass, depends from places.
Watch rally crash videos to see how grass and gravel acts in reality, when making track one should try to make such possible too, it is not hard slippery surface that grass, it is much more complicated and has great difference to result of crash, especially when car has some proper damage.
Big part of racing thrill is lost if such severity of consequences is overlooked so racers don't need to really be afraid of crashing or sliding to grass. Cars tend to tip over when sliding on grass, happens in other racing than rallying too.
Sadly there are almost none of tracks that have this even near, lot potential is not used at this area. Of course it takes time to get it right, but when one learns how to do it, it is easier for next projects.
Watch rally crash videos to see how grass and gravel acts in reality, when making track one should try to make such possible too, it is not hard slippery surface that grass, it is much more complicated and has great difference to result of crash, especially when car has some proper damage.
Big part of racing thrill is lost if such severity of consequences is overlooked so racers don't need to really be afraid of crashing or sliding to grass. Cars tend to tip over when sliding on grass, happens in other racing than rallying too.
Sadly there are almost none of tracks that have this even near, lot potential is not used at this area. Of course it takes time to get it right, but when one learns how to do it, it is easier for next projects.
davidde
hi guys, i'm having some troubles with the effect of the surface resistance and ai behavior, I will explain myself
i've done some tracks by now, on these days i'm making some kindo of "fantasy" tracks where i have "boosts" and very slippering surfaces, so: i have 3 surfaces (regular, boost & slide), the materials name are (roada, road_boost & road_slide).
roada --> grip: 1 (by default) // resistance 0.0 (by default) // sound dry (by default)
road_boost --> grip 1 // resistance -50000 (negative value so the surface "push" my car // sound gravel (so i'm sure rfactor is reading the right line in the tdf
road_slide --> grip 0.2 (is very very slippery) // resistance 0 // sound gravel
wel, roada works perfectly and road_slide too, (it's like ice with gravel sound ) but when i modify the resistance value in road_boost, my car gets affected but not the ai. when a car controled by the ai passes trough, it sound like gravel but do not get pushed (i've tried the contrary also, 50000 of resistance, i can`t drive faster than 60-70 km/h but ai cars drive normaly)
my question is why ai get affected by variations of the grip but not by variations of the resistance?, i've tried several mods (even the ones that came with rfactor and always have the same output...)
thank you very much guys!
i've done some tracks by now, on these days i'm making some kindo of "fantasy" tracks where i have "boosts" and very slippering surfaces, so: i have 3 surfaces (regular, boost & slide), the materials name are (roada, road_boost & road_slide).
roada --> grip: 1 (by default) // resistance 0.0 (by default) // sound dry (by default)
road_boost --> grip 1 // resistance -50000 (negative value so the surface "push" my car // sound gravel (so i'm sure rfactor is reading the right line in the tdf
road_slide --> grip 0.2 (is very very slippery) // resistance 0 // sound gravel
wel, roada works perfectly and road_slide too, (it's like ice with gravel sound
) but when i modify the resistance value in road_boost, my car gets affected but not the ai. when a car controled by the ai passes trough, it sound like gravel but do not get pushed (i've tried the contrary also, 50000 of resistance, i can`t drive faster than 60-70 km/h but ai cars drive normaly)my question is why ai get affected by variations of the grip but not by variations of the resistance?, i've tried several mods (even the ones that came with rfactor and always have the same output...)
thank you very much guys!
peterchen
Mmhhh, that´s strange!
I´ve played with the resistance in .TDF alot and AI is definitely affected!
I can measure it!
Can´t explain that. Maybe only positive values affects the AI?
Greets
Pete
I´ve played with the resistance in .TDF alot and AI is definitely affected!
I can measure it!
Can´t explain that. Maybe only positive values affects the AI?
Greets
Pete
davidde
well...i don't know what it is, but something is definitely wrong with my rfactor... I've modified the terrain.tdf from "locations": set road and oval road resistance to 100000.0, went to jacksonville oval and, obviously, i couldn't drive but AI runs normally and when i pushed "i" so cpu takes control of my car, it was a normal race.
I don't know what is wrong...may be something i've changed over the years on how AI reads the physics or i don`t know... the only thing i can think of is traying that on a new installation with no modifications...
davidde
nothing....i've tried a new instalation (1255c) and nothing new is happening: between this:
and this:
there are no differences, the only car slower is the one that i drive.... May be i should change some other value somewhere else, but i don't know what i am doing wrong, don't know why your AI gets affected and mine doesn't...
and this:
there are no differences, the only car slower is the one that i drive.... May be i should change some other value somewhere else, but i don't know what i am doing wrong, don't know why your AI gets affected and mine doesn't...
peterchen
Mh, in PLR file there´s something that says:
[ Game Options ]
AI Tire Model="1.00000" // 0.0 = use AI peak slip, 1.0 = use player's dynamic slip, or a blend between the two (can be overrode in TBC with AITireModel)
Maybe something to do with this one...
Is the result the same with all mods?
Greets
Pete
[ Game Options ]
AI Tire Model="1.00000" // 0.0 = use AI peak slip, 1.0 = use player's dynamic slip, or a blend between the two (can be overrode in TBC with AITireModel)
Maybe something to do with this one...
Is the result the same with all mods?
Greets
Pete
knackko
Thanks to that explanation, i succeed to make an anticut rumble with Collfrict=0.0, i can have rumble quite high to have a efficient effect for a car with a high ride height , it also works for a low ride height like De tomaso pantera without stoppping it !
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davidde
Tomorrow al try that...we'll see
yes, even with the one's that came with the basic instalation... (maybe it's is becouse of that value in the plr)
thanks
peterchen
OK davidde, please report!
Greets
Pete
Greets
Pete
davidde
well...i haven't been able to try my track becouse i can't find my proyect and have no much free time to create a new track. What i've tested is changing those values and running on a track where the AI was "autocalibrated" already and what i have noticed is that now AI drivers make a much wider line, even go off track (mostly on fasts tunrs) so there is, in fact, a difference on how the physics are calculated...on the other side, now they must learn the track again with this "new" physics and they are giving me a hard time, i mean, they have now less grip so i shoud either change some values (i think i remember AIcornergrip, brake usage or something like that) or remake the aiw fast lap (but i cant get aiw/cam EDITOR running on windows 8 (don't know why or even if it is compatible) so it is a little frustrating...i will keep trying.
davidde
Nope..that value isn't it either....the physics are different but they run over a track surface with a resistance of 5000 as normal. I will keep tryng with lower values (maybe there is a maximun value) but i'm loosing hope
what bothers me the most is that if i go off track on the grass or gravel i go slower than when they do son it is a little unfair (i know, i should drive on the tarmac
)...i will let you know if i find something. Thanks